Author Topic: Bench Grinders for sharpening  (Read 7714 times)

Offline MCB

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Bench Grinders for sharpening
« on: October 17, 2013, 10:33:15 PM »
The failure of my shed roof with consequent ingress of rainwater, means that I'm  in the market place for a new grinder for sharpening chisels & gouges.

Since ”Which?“ don't run tests on Bench Grinders, I  wonder if readers would  like to post their views and comments about the various grinders available.

And what sort of jigs do you use?

Very many thanks for taking the time to respond

MC

Offline The Bowler Hatted Turner

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Re: Bench Grinders for sharpening
« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2013, 10:49:05 PM »
Hi MC,
         there is a lot of rubbish talked written and spouted about grinders and what to use to sharpen your chisels.
I use B&G grinders with the original stones, they are now about £25 to buy. I learnt how to use them without burning or blueing the tool so I don't need a slow run grinder.The stones are about 3/4 inch wide and that has proved wide enough, so I don't need a 40mm wide stone. I have made my own fixed angle jigs and use a Sorby jig for finger nail grinds and that is my sharpening system, apart from one I made to run backwards.
 Don't get caught out by spending exhorbitant amounts of money on stuff you don't need.
    The only concession I might make is a diamond wheel, if I found one to fit.
Regards
John BHT

Offline Martin Lawrence

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Re: Bench Grinders for sharpening
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2013, 11:53:04 PM »
Have a look in the for sale section gives link to offer Lidl have for a grinder with wheel and sanding belt which is great for skews etc.

Cheers Martin
Martin Lawrence

Offline julcle

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Re: Bench Grinders for sharpening
« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2013, 12:56:45 PM »
Hi MCB  --  I am not so proficient as John and need a jig so use a Record 8" grinder with the Robert Sorby Universal 744 Jig which I find excellent for all chisels and gouges. I did however have a bit of cash in my pocket at Yandles last month and invested in a Pro-Edge. I haven't used the Grinder since ! John is right in what he says, a £25 grinder and make your own jig will work just as well as anything you can spend £400 plus on.
Location: S. Wales
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Julian

Offline David Buskell

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Re: Bench Grinders for sharpening
« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2013, 04:43:50 PM »
Hi MC,

I use a Creusen grinder with the Wolverine jig system and the fingernail grind attachment - this covers most of my tools. I've also got the Creusen honing system but haven't used it yet - luckily it wasn't new so not too much money gathering dust in the workshop!

Main tip I would pass on is make sure you have the right grit wheel - most people use white for HSS.  Our club recently got involved with the D & T Dept of a local college who were using an industrial grinder with a grey wheel - about 10 grit! -which produced a fabulous edge  but eats the steel on the tool away! We introduced them to white wheels and a grinder out of the Axminster catalogue and hopefully they are now enjoying a new turning experience.

Ask around at your club to see what kit other members have - you may be able to go along and have a play before you buy.

Hope this helps.

David
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Mark Sanger

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Re: Bench Grinders for sharpening
« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2013, 05:40:04 PM »
All of the main grinders are good and they all do the same thing, spin a sharp stone or wheel variant for you to rub your metal tools against.

The first grinder I purchased was the cheap 6 inch white wheel grinder from Record, added to it the Robert Sorby universal jig which is great if you want a long grind ( you don't need a long grind but it is useful and what I prefer).

Having tried most if not all of the grinding systems on the market, slow systems and jigs etc I can say that they are all good, I do prefer the Robert Sorby Universal jig though, but are the slow luxury grinders worth the money. ?

I still have my original Record 6 inch wheel grinder and universal jig.

You need a sharp edge, that goes without saying.

You get a sharp edge with a white wheel, you will get a sharper edge with a CBN or slow grinder with a honing system.

The sharper the edge the finer the cut, the finer the edge the faster you will lose this , a sharp tool edge has to be finer and thus will blunt quicker, especially when roughing out with bark, grit and all the other stuff that is on the outside of a log.

99% of woodturning is removing waste wood and as long as this is done efficiently with a sharp tool (with good geometry, which is obtained from using a good jig, or home made one), then the last 1%/finishing cuts are the most important. Just use a freshly sharpened tool for finishing.

My prefered finishing tool kept purely for finishing is a traditional grind 10mm bowl gouge, as this gives an exceptional finish due to the amount of cutting edge and bevel support.


There is no doubt from trying them that the more luxury grinding systems are very good. The Tormek is often reported as being slow, I would say to this that it is not designed to remove metal from the tool quickly, but to apply a sharp edge to it with good geometry, this it does extremely well.

I sharpen my main tools on a standard 6 inch white wheel, and hone my finishing tools on an 8 inch disc of MDF to which I have stuck 600 grit abrasive. This has a spigot on the back to fit into the chuck of my lathe. I use this for sharpening the finishing gouge.

So in answer to your question.

They are all good, but do you get £400 worth of better turning from them, in my opinion no. A good geometry and a sharp edge and correct tool presentation is pretty much all you need and you can get this with a standard white wheel and jig.

I keep thinking about buying a slow system with Gucci diamond wheel, but always end up spending the money on wood or taking my children out for the day instead.  :)

But if I had the spare cash yes I would have one, just like I would have a Ferrari too if I could afford it. :)


Offline The Bowler Hatted Turner

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Re: Bench Grinders for sharpening
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2013, 10:31:03 AM »
Now you see I wouldn't have a Ferrari, not enough boot space for my turning tools :D
One of the most important things(IMHO) for sharpening is repeatability.
Spend the money you save on cheaper grinders and buy a decent grinding jig. Like Mark I prefer the Sorby Universal jig but I have to say that is the only commercially produced  jig I have used.
   I made a B&Q grinder run backwards and turned it(in effect) into a linisher and I use this for my skews but also, if I do need a finer finish straight from the chisel I will hone the chisel on this machine.
    Realistically, if your cut is "clean" and the bevel has rubbed during the cut, the modern day abrasives are capable of producing the finish you require.

On second thoughts I could always put my tools in a trailer, do they do towing hooks for Ferraris? ::)
Regards
John BHT

Offline john taylor

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Re: Bench Grinders for sharpening
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2013, 12:15:28 PM »
Now you see I wouldn't have a Ferrari, not enough boot space for my turning tools :D
One of the most important things(IMHO) for sharpening is repeatability.
Spend the money you save on cheaper grinders and buy a decent grinding jig. Like Mark I prefer the Sorby Universal jig but I have to say that is the only commercially produced  jig I have used.
   I made a B&Q grinder run backwards and turned it(in effect) into a linisher and I use this for my skews but also, if I do need a finer finish straight from the chisel I will hone the chisel on this machine.
    Realistically, if your cut is "clean" and the bevel has rubbed during the cut, the modern day abrasives are capable of producing the finish you require.

On second thoughts I could always put my tools in a trailer, do they do towing hooks for Ferraris? ::)
Regards
John BHT

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=273152&f=23&h=0  ;D

john

Andy Coates

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Re: Bench Grinders for sharpening
« Reply #8 on: October 20, 2013, 07:39:30 PM »
I use the Record Power 8" BG with the 40mm white wheel. I have the Wolverine jig, which I chose after trying everything else available. It does exactly what I require it to do.

As Mark rightly says, finer edge systems are fine, but any super fine edge is a compromise with durability. What's the point of a super-sharp edge that is gone the minute the tool hits the wood? I'd rather had a more durable edge.

The RPBG8 is often on show offer for about £40. The white wheels are about £22 to replace ( I go through 1 a year). I've used the grinder for eight years without issue. It's a no brainer for me.

As others have said, I'm often tempted by the CBN wheels, but I'll have to wait until the cost wouldn't itself be a compromise with something else...like eating!

Offline The Bowler Hatted Turner

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Re: Bench Grinders for sharpening
« Reply #9 on: October 20, 2013, 10:07:15 PM »
For John Taylor,
 ;D ;D ;D ;D

Mark Sanger

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Re: Bench Grinders for sharpening
« Reply #10 on: October 21, 2013, 08:23:45 AM »
Now you see I wouldn't have a Ferrari, not enough boot space for my turning tools :D
One of the most important things(IMHO) for sharpening is repeatability.
Spend the money you save on cheaper grinders and buy a decent grinding jig. Like Mark I prefer the Sorby Universal jig but I have to say that is the only commercially produced  jig I have used.
   I made a B&Q grinder run backwards and turned it(in effect) into a linisher and I use this for my skews but also, if I do need a finer finish straight from the chisel I will hone the chisel on this machine.
    Realistically, if your cut is "clean" and the bevel has rubbed during the cut, the modern day abrasives are capable of producing the finish you require.

On second thoughts I could always put my tools in a trailer, do they do towing hooks for Ferraris? ::)
Regards
John BHT

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=273152&f=23&h=0  ;D

john


Thanks John

Now all I have to is sell a few more noodle bowls. :) :)

Offline Richard Findley

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Re: Bench Grinders for sharpening
« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2013, 11:25:06 PM »

The RPBG8 is often on show offer for about £40. The white wheels are about £22 to replace ( I go through 1 a year). I've used the grinder for eight years without issue. It's a no brainer for me.

As others have said, I'm often tempted by the CBN wheels, but I'll have to wait until the cost wouldn't itself be a compromise with something else...like eating!

Bloody hell Andy! A wheel a year? You either grind a hell of a lot of steel or Record make their wheels from cheese!

I used to use an antique grinder which was a bit short on guards. When I started teaching I thought I should cross the i's and dot the t's as it were, so bought a decent grinder. I'd managed with a 1" stone so treated myself to one with 40mm wheels. I figured 8" would last longer than 6" so I went for that, and seeing as I was spending anyway I thought sod it, and went for slow running. I chose an Axminster model and it still only cost me £100 about 4 years ago. Still on the original wheels, and I only use one end!

Really tempted by the CBN wheel and everyone I speak to raves about them but it really hurts to spend £200 on a grinding wheel. When my white now wears out I probably will take the plunge but I reckon there's another couple of years in it yet!

As for jigs, I was always too tightfisted to buy one, and by the time I could afford it I was pretty good at doing it without, so I still just use the tilting platform and do it freehand.

Cheers

Richard
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