Tormek T-4 and TNT-808

[David Holden]

Hello again!

At the moment I'm using one of the cheapest Axminster grinders available on their website (AC200BG 200mm) and it isn't very good. It's ok for sharpening skew chisels and other chisels with a straight edge but I can't turn any gouges without the steel overheating, I bought a jig to help but it hasn't helped much really.

I'm thinking of getting the Tormek T-4 Sharpening System and the TNT-808 Woodturner’s Kit. Does anyone use this? Is there much difference between this and the T-8?

https://www.axminstertools.com/tormek-t-4-sharpening-system-with-tnt-808-woodturner-s-kit-720737

Regards
David

[Twisted Trees]

2" is the main difference, the T4 uses an 8" wheel, the T8 uses a 10" one. There are speed differences between them as well. I gave up on my T7 sold it and bought the Sorby ProEdge instead, absolutely nothing wrong with Tormek, they are the masters of the wet grind system often imitated never equalled, but wet grinding takes time to set up, and clear up at the end of the day, I have no water in my workshop so had to remember to take a bottle of water down to it if I was going to sharpen, silly niggles really as the Tormek really does do a good job of sharpening a lot of things.

[Bill21]

I don’t know what the gouges you want to sharpen are made of but it’s not easy to overheat HSS with normal sharpening. HSS can supposedly get red hot and still maintain its hardness. If you’re using older “Tool Steel” gouges then they can loose their edge much easier if you overheat them.

I often use HSS on my metal turning lathe and have inadvertently blued the steel whilst sharpening on several occasions and it’s had no noticeable effect on the cutting edge.

I second the Sorby ProEdge. The ability to quickly change belts and therefore the grits is in itself very useful. Reshaping a gouge can be done quickly with a 60 grit belt and then swapped for a 120 for sharpening. I’ve used 240 grit belts for carving tools and you get a virtually polished edge.

The relatively new Axminster Ultimate Edge May be an even better proposition if it’s within budget as it is reversible and variable speed and takes existing Tormek jigs.

https://www.axminstertools.com/axminster-trade-ultimate-edge-variable-speed-sharpening-system-106232

[David Holden]

2" is the main difference, the T4 uses an 8" wheel, the T8 uses a 10" one. There are speed differences between them as well. I gave up on my T7 sold it and bought the Sorby ProEdge instead, absolutely nothing wrong with Tormek, they are the masters of the wet grind system often imitated never equalled, but wet grinding takes time to set up, and clear up at the end of the day, I have no water in my workshop so had to remember to take a bottle of water down to it if I was going to sharpen, silly niggles really as the Tormek really does do a good job of sharpening a lot of things.

Thanks Pete. I've been looking at the Robert Sorby ProEdge since you mentioned it and I must say it looks really good! I'll continue my research but this has just become the front runner I think! Thank you!

[David Holden]

I don’t know what the gouges you want to sharpen are made of but it’s not easy to overheat HSS with normal sharpening. HSS can supposedly get red hot and still maintain its hardness. If you’re using older “Tool Steel” gouges then they can loose their edge much easier if you overheat them.

I often use HSS on my metal turning lathe and have inadvertently blued the steel whilst sharpening on several occasions and it’s had no noticeable effect on the cutting edge.

I second the Sorby ProEdge. The ability to quickly change belts and therefore the grits is in itself very useful. Reshaping a gouge can be done quickly with a 60 grit belt and then swapped for a 120 for sharpening. I’ve used 240 grit belts for carving tools and you get a virtually polished edge.

The relatively new Axminster Ultimate Edge May be an even better proposition if it’s within budget as it is reversible and variable speed and takes existing Tormek jigs.

https://www.axminstertools.com/axminster-trade-ultimate-edge-variable-speed-sharpening-system-106232

Thanks Bill. The gouges have lost their shape and I'm struggling to get it back with the jig I have at the moment, it's not easy to use at all and still basically requires you to sharpen it free hand, I'm losing a lot of steel every time I sharpen them and just end up using carbides, but I really want to use the traditional chisels as well. The ProEdge looks really really good and it seems a better choice for me over the Tormek at the moment! The Tormek does look superb but ease of use goes to the ProEdge from what I can see.

Thanks mate.

[Bill21]

I think it’s rather ironic that both the Sorby ProEdge and the Axminster Ultimate Edge both use the Tormek gouge jig. I actually use a Record Power belt and disc sander to sharpen my tools and also use a Tormek jig bought from Robert Sorby! 

[Twisted Trees]

I think it’s rather ironic that both the Sorby ProEdge and the Axminster Ultimate Edge both use the Tormek gouge jig. I actually use a Record Power belt and disc sander to sharpen my tools and also use a Tormek jig bought from Robert Sorby! 

It is a clamp and swivel kind of job :-) when something is done right why do it again! I rate the Tormek highest of the sharpening systems as it sharpens more things well, and gets my tools sharper than the ProEdge ever will, but they are hand tool sharp and the edge doesn't last long at 1000rpm, then they are equal.

Proedge sharpens less things well, it just happens that the subset it does well is woodturning tools which is what I use. and apart from when reprofiling which is new tools and "damn who put that nail in there" times! I only ever use the diamond belt. and as I use the 40/40 grind a lot at the moment I don't use any jigs just put it on the table and bring back the edge.

[David Holden]

Yeah, it's only woodturning tools I need sharpening and profiling really. I have axes but I quite like sharpening them with a puck, today I spent the afternoon sat in the sun sharpening one of them. I'll keep the Axminster grinder as well, I won't get rid of it.

[Bill21]

when something is done right why do it again!

Well actually Tormek did. There are currently two versions of their gouge jig available, the SVD 185 and SVD 186.

[Twisted Trees]

when something is done right why do it again!

Well actually Tormek did. There are currently two versions of their gouge jig available, the SVD 185 and SVD 186.

Sorby are on Mk3, having licensed Mk1 from Tormek but the principles are the same as the original, I don't actually know who did the design, but they were good!
 

[Bill21]

Given that advice I’ve seen from Sorby not to alter the angle on the jig I can’t help thinking it may have been better to have a more simple fixed jig. I suspect though that it was cheaper to buy in the jig from Tormek rather than manufacture their own. The jigs do work well though and much more compact than some of the contraptions seen over the pond! 

Although much more expensive I do like the fact that the Axminster Ultimate Edge makes use of many of the Tormek jigs.

https://youtu.be/L4JgPh3FJng

[Twisted Trees]

Axminster version wasn't out when I bought mine, I would have looked at it if it was, The Sorby jig and it's use has been modified by the creation of the 3 hole long grind swivel, what that achieves was originally done by adjusting the length / angle of the jig, but using the 3 hole one there is no real need to do it anymore.  Obviously all jigs = compromise, but repeatable angles no matter what they are can be learned and it saves time effort and steel to use jigs as a rule, I don't always as I said somewhere up the thread I am using the 40/40 grind a lot at the moment because I am enjoying it! and that has to be done mostly freehand (set table to 40° and I have 40° angles put on it with marker pen to start / stop the swing).

[Bill21]

When I bought mine Sorby only sold the single hole boss. Soon after it came out though someone kindly gave me one of the three hole bosses. The principal is fine but I had trouble with an old short gouge some time ago so I made a new short boss to accommodate it.

[David Holden]

I'm pretty sure I'm going to get the ProEdge now thanks to you both! There are quite a few deluxe versions for sale with the jig I need for under £400.

I might buy my wife something with the money I've saved! (or a couple of new chisels) 

[RichardS]

I have the ProEdge but never really got the most from it and when Axminster brought out there version i could see they had addressed many of the shortcomings I was experiencing, I toyed with buying but decided instead to modify the Pro Edge.

I fitted a longer platen and fitted the Axi multi jig plus repositioned the unit on its base plate, the results were as good as i had hoped and even invested in the Axi CBN Belt.

I now use the Tormek range of jigs and use the Tormek settings without any problem and grind repeatability is always achieved.

The only thing I cannot do is reverse the rotation which is a luxury i can live without, well for now that is.