AWGB Woodturning Forum
General Category => AWGB News & Announcements => Topic started by: Paul Hannaby on November 07, 2015, 04:56:13 PM
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We have produced a questionnaire to obtain feedback on future seminars / symposia. Feel free to visit the website and fill in the questionnaire.
www.awgb.co.uk/woodturning-seminar-symposia-questionnaire/ (http://www.awgb.co.uk/woodturning-seminar-symposia-questionnaire/)
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Your link doesnt work it has a few extras you need to remove %22http// at the begining and the /" at the end.
john
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here is the correct link
http://www.awgb.co.uk/woodturning-seminar-symposia-questionnaire/
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Thanks, link fixed!
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Anyone can complete the questionnaire, members and non members
Cheers Dave
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Hi All
I think that we need to share this on FB it's on the AWGB FB page the more people that see it the better the rate of feedback :)
Ed
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Hi All
I think that we need to share this on FB it's on the AWGB FB page the more people that see it the better the rate of feedback :)
Ed
Good idea, done.
Pete
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I filled the Questionnaire in but every time I tried to SUBMIT it rejected it saying Invalid Number ::) ??? ??? ???
Regards John
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It is probably referring to the price you agree for the seminar. Leave the £ sign off if you are using it, just a number.
Pete
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It is probably referring to the price you agree for the seminar. Leave the £ sign off if you are using it, just a number.
Pete
I had exactly the same problem.....the statement asked an open question, which I tried to answer in a simple sentence, but ended up having to prune it back to a number without any words/symbols/punctuation.
Les
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That's how I found out Les lol.
Pete
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I think question about the fee should have a yes / no box then ask what you would be willing to spend as another question.
Ed
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There are actually two questions to that one, hence perhaps the confusion? Constructing surveys is never easy thoug, done a few and no matter how you try it is always close to impossible to ask the right questions in the right way Thanks to whoever put this one together though.
Pete
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Thanks for the feedback, I have changed the validation on the price question so it allows both text and numbers so that should avoid the problem!
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Unfortunately the survey appears to suffer a degree of confirmation bias.
In other words you're asking questions to get the answers you want, rather than gather the information you need to make good decisions.
There's also a couple of silly questions that don't give a good impression.
As examples;
"Do you use the internet ?"
What's the point of this on an online form ?
Why ask for what region people live in when you already asked for their address ?
It will be useful to you to specify the possible regions, rather than let people write unhelpful localisations.
"Would you be interested in a seminar over 2 or 3 days ?"
What you need to discover is if there's a demand for a daily event attendance or a market for an even longer event.
"Would you consider air travel ... ?"
Pointless question as all you really need to know is how far people are prepared to travel, not by what method.
It would be more useful to know if people would like any venue to be close to public transport (train/coach/airport) or expect free car parking.
Specifying a preferred month isn't much use. It needs, at least, the option for more than a single month. What you need to know is if any particular times of year are preferable or disadvantageous.
eg summer/winter/school holidays, some people might prefer a seminar to be anytime except holiday seasons.
"A three day event will cost........£250"
Given the losses this year, is it really wise to specify any sort of figure ?
What you need to know is how much people might be prepared to pay per day for an event.
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I don't agree. The questions are designed to have simple Y/N answers in the main to questions we'd like to hear about. There is a comments space if you want to say anything else.
The name and address field are optional.
The questionnaire is actually designed to be filled in by individuals on paper as we know many of our members don't use the internet. What we have done is to put the whole questionnaire online and I have had a number of replies already, so there may be the odd redundant question. But I don't see that as a big issue. I don't want to have to consolidate a number of different questionnaires.
Over 2 or 3 days. Important to us. we don't have the resources to organise a longer one and it's not hard 2 days or 3 days. We had daily options this year (and I know we've had that discussion on the other thread) and many people did just attend for a day.
Can't see what's difficult in suggesting which month you prefer. We won't please everyone that's for sure.
The figure is important. We know that it costs around this much to put an event of this size on. For example I have had some replies to my request for quotation from venues and the demonstration space costs over £3k for the weekend. Expenses for demonstrators from the states start at over £1000 for air fare. Many people have said they only want to pay less which is an option.
We can roll this around for ever before we please everyone. I have no intention of changing it. Those that have answered it so far (many at clubs already on paper) and many online seem to have found it easy enough.
Cheers Dave
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I don't agree..... I have no intention of changing it.
No great surprise there.
Can't see what's difficult in suggesting which month you prefer.
It's not about the difficulty in answering. My point was that it won't get you the information that would be useful.
The whole thing is a great example of confirmation bias, as you only want the answers you think you know already.
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Paul,
I disagree with all your points, with the exception of the question about internet use but Dave has already explained why that was there. When I created the web form, I did consider leaving that question out but I decided to leave it in for completeness.
For someone who has never been a member and has never supported anything we have done, you seem to have a lot to say! :-)
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Here we go again all PaulH seems to do is CRITICISE every thing that anyone does or says on behalf of the AWGB as I have asked before why
don't you join the AWGB ? I again invite you to Join ???
I find as I have said on a previous thread your remarks are not very helpful I would like to say more out of my frustration but I would probably be
banned from the Forum >:( >:(
John
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Here we go again all PaulH seems to do is CRITICISE every thing that anyone does or says on behalf of the AWGB
Do you understand the concept of constructive criticism ? It's about pointing out failings and suggesting how they might be improved. Many businesses and other charities pay huge amounts for that service from consultants.
Did you read the OP about the seminar ?.....If you have any suggestions about how we could improve the Seminar experience......
I did that. Some people didn't want to read of any failings, but if they don't want to make a 'significant loss' again for their members it's important that they address any issues brought to their attention.
Go back and re-read what I've actually posted, not what your prejudice thinks it might mean.
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I have just completed the questionnaire, and have found it straightforward and askinkg for opinions about the organisation of the event with an open suggestions box foe ANY comments. No problem and well done for putting it together. Malcolm.
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I have to agree with much of what Paul says, some of the questions do seem pointless or difficult to answer ( there is no way of saying I don't care which month of the year it is ) equally, some of the other questions would carry provisos in the answer. I don't really mind whether accommodation is onsite or offsite but since I don't drive it couldn't be to far away.
The main problem encountered with Loughborough was the distance from the accommodation to the lecture hall ( yes, we are mostly old farts ) I would have happily contributed to several morning and evening ( timed or announced ) runs from the minibus which would have solved that problem.
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I don't agree..... I have no intention of changing it.
No great surprise there.
Can't see what's difficult in suggesting which month you prefer.
It's not about the difficulty in answering. My point was that it won't get you the information that would be useful.
The whole thing is a great example of confirmation bias, as you only want the answers you think you know already.
The reason I am not changing the questionnaire is that it is now ready for publishing in Revolutions and is already in use and many people have responded so we're not changing horses midstream. Secondly, although you insist your comments are constructive you haven't actually suggested any questions that we should ask.
In the other thread I wrote "But we have a number of ideas - we shall seek sponsorship; we have approached nine different venue providers for information and a quotation and I expect these back by the end of November; we shall consider a new look and feel; we shall try to provide a varied programme to try to meet all tastes and interests." We continue to receive all suggestions, whether they've been tried before or not. We'll review them all during the first quarter 2016 when we know about venue charges. So please don't suggest we don't listen.
And your suggestion that we make it easier for people to find out what attendance options are available have been taken on board. I must also point out that had you been a member, an individual one like me, you would have had a copy of Revs where the seminar was advertised in all its glory many times, including all the attendance options. We actually know what the problem is we have 4000 members and less than 5% want to come, or are not prepared to come. The questionnaire is designed to find out why. As I don't know what the correct answer is to any of the questions I hardly see it as an exercise in confirmation bias. I'm also interested in your comment that we won't get the information that would be useful. With respect, how do you know what information we will find useful?
Graham if you aren't bothered which month then the answer to the question is "any".
Dave
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OK. My Pennyworth. The AWGB is run and maintained basically by a very few volounteers who put their all into it and deserve a lot more gratitude and thanks than they probably get. When you look at the number of members and the number of people actively involved it is frankly ridiculous. To have non members criticising, whether positive or otherwise and yet not prepared to actually offer help is, in my opinion, just going too far. Put up or shut up is something my grandmother taught me and if anyone (me included) wants to pick holes in what the few are doing then offer not just advice but help as well. I want woodturning to be recognised as a craft and art form in this country as it is in the States, Australia and one or two other places and am happy to do whatever I can to promote it but I cannot stand by whilst others pick holes and criticise from the sidelines those who try. Criticism, if given with an aim to improve is always valid but maybe the way it is put, and the attitude behind it should be.thought through as well. Thank you to all of you who actually do the work of th AWGB, whether I agree with everything you do or the way that you do is irrelevant, thank you!!!!!!!
Pete, AWGB, RPT, totally disorganised but always willing to help
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The reason I am not changing the questionnaire is that it is now ready for publishing in Revolutions
I didn't seriously expect anything else.
A shame as one of the key advantages of the internet is the ability to change things like this immediately. It might just be correcting a typing mistake, or eliminating a silly idea that reflects badly on the site, or just reacting to feedback to refine the page and improve the usefullness of the data returned.
A prime example is "do you use the internet ?" It looks silly on a web page and the answer for that respondent is already defined anyway. It's in the same class as a survey by phone call asking if you have a telephone.
although you insist your comments are constructive you haven't actually suggested any questions that we should ask.
The problem here is not that you haven't asked enough questions, but that in some cases you've limited the range of answers possible or allowed too wide a range of answers to make data analysis straight forward.
I must also point out that had you been a member, an individual one like me, you would have had a copy of Revs where the seminar was advertised in all its glory many times, including all the attendance options.
But I'm not a member, although you'd like non-members to attend and, hopefully, become part of the AWGB, correct ?
We actually know what the problem is we have 4000 members and less than 5% want to come, or are not prepared to come.
or weren't able to attend.
Is members failing to be interested enough to attend 'The problem' ? or is it just insufficient numbers of people attending 'The problem' ? there's a significant difference there.
Or did you just misjudge how much you should charge ? which is a different problem again.
You may have decided that members failing to attend is the main cause of the loss, but you can't be sure of that. Just getting 40 non-members to attend would have allowed you to break even, one more would have seen you in profit.
The questionnaire is designed to find out why.
I don't have an easy answer to that, but I hope you've surveyed those that did attend their views and whether they would have been prepared to pay enough to have broken even.
If the questionnaire is specifically aimed at the 95% of AWGB members that didn't attend, you shouldn't make it public.
As I don't know what the correct answer is to any of the questions I hardly see it as an exercise in confirmation bias.
The problem with confirmation bias, is that the creators of the survey aren't aware of the bias. Sometimes it's easier for an outsider to see that a survey is going to give erroneous information, than the authors.
I'm also interested in your comment that we won't get the information that would be useful. With respect, how do you know what information we will find useful?
As I've said, sometimes it's easier for an outsider with any preconceived ideas or prejudices to see what information would be useful than for people tied up with precedent.
Graham if you aren't bothered which month then the answer to the question is "any".
Except that isn't a possible answer.
Start to see my point now ?
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To have non members criticising, whether positive or otherwise and yet not prepared to actually offer help is, in my opinion, just going too far.
So constructive criticism from non-members isn't welcome then ?
What sort of 'help' do you expect ?
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If you think there are areas that you know more about than the ones doing all the work and can help, PM David, Andy or Paul and offer your expertise. Whilst I may agree with some of your observations the way that they are put are not helpful I am afraid. As someone who has a lot of experience in working in areas that need diplomacy and tact I am afraid that I ahve to say your way of putting things, however well meaning they may be, are not always helpful. Saying what is wrong is not enough, what could be done to improve and promote the AWGB are all valid observations but having a little insight into the workload of those doing it at the moment I would think that it would be a little more sensitive to offer your criticisms via a PM than voice them as you do publicly in a way that, though you may not see it, come across as simply criticism. Perhaps it is just the medium, things said vocally can be heard as they are meant, put into writing or online they can seem cold and hard.
pete
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Not very helpful in this situation I know, but I can see both sides of this 'discussion' If you really want to know 'Why people didn't attend the seminar' It might be useful to send out a question asking 'Why didn't you come to the seminar ?'
I am not trying to be flippant but I have a feeling the answers ( If you actually get any :) ) may surprise you. They may have nothing to do with the work that you did for the seminar.
'I am getting to old for that, I don't even turn any more'
'I'm on a small pension/minimum wage, I cannot afford it'
'I have been before, I cannot walk up those hills again'
'I have been out of work, other things come first'
'The wife would kill me'
'I am not good enough yet to come to that'
etc etc.
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Not very helpful in this situation I know, but I can see both sides of this 'discussion' If you really want to know 'Why people didn't attend the seminar' It might be useful to send out a question asking 'Why didn't you come to the seminar ?'
I am not trying to be flippant but I have a feeling the answers ( If you actually get any :) ) may surprise you. They may have nothing to do with the work that you did for the seminar.
'I am getting to old for that, I don't even turn any more'
'I'm on a small pension/minimum wage, I cannot afford it'
'I have been before, I cannot walk up those hills again'
'I have been out of work, other things come first'
'The wife would kill me'
'I am not good enough yet to come to that'
etc etc.
Actually all valid points. I remember your concerns about attending Graham which were valid and when asked about were answered.
Pete
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PM David, Andy or Paul and offer your expertise.
That's email, not a forum.
I post my contributions openly so that others might agree or disagree and that the discussion might develop.
Perhaps it is just the medium, things said vocally can be heard as they are meant, put into writing or online they can seem cold and hard.
Just read things as written, there's no hidden agenda here.
The worst attitude online is 'if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything' no one learns from that.
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Well PaulH I have one more Question to ask you "Are you actually a Woodturner" please be specific a yes or no will do please.
John
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You are right Pete and I am really glad I went.
I think the question ( why didn't you go ) is tied up with other aspects of the AWGB like.....
If there are 4000 members why are there only about a dozen regular posters on here ?
There are 40+ members of my club, why are only a handful of them AWGB members ?
Times have changed. These are the days of 'Ask not what I can do for the AWGB, ask what the AWGB can do for me'
Somehow we have to show people that £16 (?) quid a year is a good deal and £400 a weekend is an even better deal.
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"Are you actually a Woodturner" please be specific a yes or no will do please.
Of course, why would I take so much effort to try to help the AWGB if I wasn't interested.
I was at Toolpost's open day yesterday(BTW, why wasn't there a AWGB presence there given they're corporate members ?) and spent a nice afternoon today in my workshop starting to make a box in the style of Jason Breach who was giving an excellent demonstration there. The olive ash I was using wasn't as dry as I'd hoped, so I've ended up partially turning the main body and will leave it a few weeks before trying to finish it off properly.
Do you have anything constructive to add to this debate other than bullying me ?
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I was also at the Toolpost yesterday afternoon watching Jason. :)
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PM David, Andy or Paul and offer your expertise.
That's email, not a forum.
I post my contributions openly so that others might agree or disagree and that the discussion might develop.
Perhaps it is just the medium, things said vocally can be heard as they are meant, put into writing or online they can seem cold and hard.
Just read things as written, there's no hidden agenda here.
The worst attitude online is 'if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything' no one learns from that.
Paul, please stop and think what you are saying because whether you mean to or not you are coming across as someone who is always in the right and no-one else is ever. The contribution of the AWGB over the last 25 years or so is immense and the work has been done by a precious few people. The membership is predominantly non active with the work done by at best 20 members who give up their free time to keep it running. How to improve it, make it more viable in the community are all valid areas for critique but personally if I cannot do more than just offer 'advice' I would shut up. I am happy to help in whatever ways I can and hope that that is apparent but I do not feel that anyone who cannot even be prepared to pay the subscription fee should feel they have the right to offer criticism unless they are also willing to back that up with active participation in some way. Anyone can look at any organisation and find fault but if they aren't willing to put their money where their mouth is (colloquially speaking before you infer I refer to paying the subscription) then I do not think that they should be so vocal in their coindemnations. You have joined this forum, have probably posted more on this particular thread than any one other and as such not given any evidence of your actual experience as a turner, or as an organiser in such matters as the AWGB. You may reply to this again but rest assured that I am done. Experience working in the fields that I have have made me know when there is no point in trying to continue 'discussing' a matter with someone who will only hear what he wants to.
Pete
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I didn't want to get embroiled in a war of words so have not commented on any of this so far..........however I have one or two observations to make.
The AWGB is a member led organisation and without the members stating what it is they want the Executive will gain no feedback regarding anything they say,do or organise.
Regarding the questionnaire, specifically the question about the internet. As I went around the country meeting members in my former capacity of SW rep I came to realise that many of the older generation simply do not understand the internet at all. One person told me that he will not get the internet as he does not want his bank details to be hacked, he didn't believe me when I said you have to put your bank details in first for that to happen. So any question that clarifies a point, no matter how ridiculous it may seem, can only be a good thing.
The other point I would like to make is the forum is open to all turners and not just AWGB members and although it would be nice to swell our numbers by trying to get new members through the forum I think we are more likely to achieve that by behaving in a polite and civil manner regardless of the way we interpret the tone of comments, it is difficult to detect inflection of written words.
Lastly, when you look back over the posts our small group are usually of one accord which although nice is not necessarily the best thing for the organisation. We probably have a blinkered view and so I feel that it could be a good thing to get an opinion from someone who is not a member, has not attended the seminar and is not afraid to upset anyone. It would also be nice to have constructive comments from all participants. One way to get these comments is to email Dave as he said in a previous posting , the other is to fill in the questionaire regardless of how we as individuals feel the information will be used.
But it should all be done with good grace and with the same outcome in mind.
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I didn't want to get embroiled in a war of words so have not commented on any of this so far..........however I have one or two observations to make.
The AWGB is a member led organisation and without the members stating what it is they want the Executive will gain no feedback regarding anything they say,do or organise.
Regarding the questionnaire, specifically the question about the internet. As I went around the country meeting members in my former capacity of SW rep I came to realise that many of the older generation simply do not understand the internet at all. One person told me that he will not get the internet as he does not want his bank details to be hacked, he didn't believe me when I said you have to put your bank details in first for that to happen. So any question that clarifies a point, no matter how ridiculous it may seem, can only be a good thing.
The other point I would like to make is the forum is open to all turners and not just AWGB members and although it would be nice to swell our numbers by trying to get new members through the forum I think we are more likely to achieve that by behaving in a polite and civil manner regardless of the way we interpret the tone of comments, it is difficult to detect inflection of written words.
Lastly, when you look back over the posts our small group are usually of one accord which although nice is not necessarily the best thing for the organisation. We probably have a blinkered view and so I feel that it could be a good thing to get an opinion from someone who is not a member, has not attended the seminar and is not afraid to upset anyone. It would also be nice to have constructive comments from all participants. One way to get these comments is to email Dave as he said in a previous posting , the other is to fill in the questionaire regardless of how we as individuals feel the information will be used.
But it should all be done with good grace and with the same outcome in mind.
[/quote
Amen, thank you Johm
Goodnight
pete
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We probably have a blinkered view and so I feel that it could be a good thing to get an opinion from someone who is not a member, has not attended the seminar and is not afraid to upset anyone.
It's nice to read that at least one person here understands that alternative views might be of some value if you seriously want to encourage new members to join up, compared to the "everything is wonderful" and the "if you don't like it you're worthless" attitude some people have expressed.
Yes, sure there are some people who don't use the internet, but as I've said before, if you have a survey on the internet "do you use the internet?" is a foregone conclusion that doesn't need asking.
Maybe more importantly for the longer outlook. The future of woodturning is with younger people and they universally understand the internet and think it's important. Having questions like "do you use the internet?" on an online form, just discredits the organisation from it's future potential membership.
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Paul I am afraid I have to disagree with you on this point. Just because people are on the internet does not mean that they actually use it. Also bear in mind that it is easier to produce one lot of questions that can be viewed on the net or via snail mail such as Revs.
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I've been following this thread (and also the other one about seminar attendance and the next seminar) with quite some interest. And before anybody asks, I am an AWGB member, I was at the seminar, and yes, I am also an active turner.
It would appear to me that the AWGB as an organisation is in a slightly tricky spot. Although the seminar was very well organized and executed, attendance figures were insufficient, resulting in a loss of 10k. To the folks who did all the work that is basically adding insult to injury. Clearly something went wrong.
It is always in these situations that emotions ride high, because for many there is also personal pride at stake (and don't get me wrong, I think they have reason to be proud of what was achieved).
I do think that PaulH has made a lot of valid points. The way they are presented is very matter-of-fact, and whilst I can see where Pete is coming from, I happen to think that the times of being nice to each other so we don't cause any offences are over.
There is a real danger of the next seminar not happening. There is also a possibility that some new kids on the block (UKIWS) pull a magic rabbit out of the hat, and steal the show. If these are to be avoided, the naked truth has to be faced square on. It shouldn't matter whether PaulH is a member or not, his contributions here should be considered and then either be discarded (for whatever reason) or implemented.
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Well said Fuzzy.
It must be very hard to ask for suggestions etc and not take any criticisms personally.
The team did a fantastic job with the seminar, it made a profound impression on me and I don't feel the need for many changes, but how do we sell it to a few more people ?
It is OK to say that the joys of woodturning needs to be spread to the younger section of the community but that will take many years to being about. We have to accept that for now ( i.e, the next seminar ) we have to deal with / appeal to a more aged membership.
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Not wishing to get embroiled in any 'tit for tat' comments, I would say that I totally agree with both Pete and BHT's.
I would ask PaulH a couple of questions:
As a self professed expert cameraman with years of experience, did you volunteer your services to the AWGB for the recent Seminar?
and
Did you ask Peter Hemsley why there was no AWGB attendance at the Toolpost?
I will make no further posts to this thread.
Dave
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As a self professed expert cameraman with years of experience, did you volunteer your services to the AWGB for the recent Seminar?
No, I'm not a member and I wasn't free for it all anyway.
Frankly, I work hard enough that spending three days working for free isn't at all appealing.
Did you ask Peter Hemsley why there was no AWGB attendance at the Toolpost?
No. I thanked him for running the event as I left.
I have no idea if the AWGB choose not attend trade events like this or if their presence was unwanted.
I would have thought that it would be a perfect place to attract new members and could also 'add value' to the event for Toolpost too.
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As a self professed expert cameraman with years of experience, did you volunteer your services to the AWGB for the recent Seminar?
No, I'm not a member and I wasn't free for it all anyway.
Frankly, I work hard enough that spending three days working for free isn't at all appealing.
PaulH that last statement will bring you some flak! I am self employed (and that means working more than a standard 5 day week most weeks), and have been on the committee since 2009 and helped run and organise 4 seminars since which mean giving up a lot more than 3 days believe me. It felt like most of my life this year!
But I'm not bothered. Neither do I take anything that is said here personally, neither am I downhearted about the loss at the Seminar. The AWGB has organised a seminar every 2 years since 1987 and what we achieve is an event of world class status. It isn't elitist, or cliquey and we set the charges at a price we feel people can afford that will at least break even. We set the price slightly lower this time than the seminar before and took account of feedback from the last seminar. It wasn't enough and as a group of Trustees we have taken the decision to revisit our assumptions - hence the reason we are taking a number of steps to make sure we continue to provide an event at an affordable cost that is enticing to turners across the UK and overseas. And we get people from USA, Spain, Iceland, mainland Europe and Israel (this time) and from Australia last time as well.
We are very good at organising the event and putting it together. I take Graham's point about why people don't come and I've heard them before.
We have given a lot of thought to the questionnaire. The results so far are interesting and worthy of analysis. Perhaps there is some confirmation bias, but it's as good as it gets with the resources we have available. Just because the answer to one question is obvious (do you use the internet doesn't mean the rest is useless. And many people have replied with valid and useful comments.
When it comes to attending events we have a show programme. We attend a number of woody (Harrogate et al) and non woody (county) shows. If we are invited to attend corporate events we will. In the case you mention we weren't. We are 15 Trustees many of whom work full time. We are located across the UK and we can't attend everything everywhere. We cant afford it in terms of the AWGB's money or the available funds. And just as you don't want to give up your free time we have to balance the amount of time we give up.
Keep your comments coming but please give me something concrete to work on.
Dave
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Paul you are quite right in saying it would be a good place for the AWGB to recruit more members but bear in mine the only people that attend these events are woody type people and so the AWGB would be preaching to the converted (mainly) people. However in order to bring woodturning to the notice of a wider audience perhaps woodworking shows are not the best place to be.
The other thing that should be taken into consideration is mannning an event such as this, I know everyone gets fed up hearing the same old thing but without volunteers to do it it just does not happen. With the number of events going on around the country the volunteers canot be expected to man every event.
I wonder how many turners local to Toolpost even noticed the AWGB were not there? I also wonder how many turners local to Toolpost would volunteer their time at the next Toolpost event? not many I suspect.
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Hi PaulH,
As I see it you have no understanding about the running of the AWGB and why would you not being a member you do not get all the
communications that members receive which are considerable.In fact I would go as far to say you know nothing about the constitution of the AWGB
or are even remotely interested. You just like sniping from the side lines.It is a good job all of the Trustees of the AWGB do not take your selfish
attitude "I am not working for Free"
I just hope all of the Members are not upset or put off giving their time by your comments I also put a lot of my time in to a branch of the AWGB
I will now say this will be my last comments on this thread and quite frankly I think enough has been said. >:(
John
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Just for future reference..... I am only 3 miles from the Toolpost and if asked I would be happy to man a small stand handing out leaflets.
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Just completed the questionnaire after reading through the posts above. Personally I can't see what all the fuss is about regarding the questions. Those questions to which a Yes or No didn't fully express my opinion I simply commented on in the box at the end.
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That's what I like to see - someone applying some common sense! ;-)
Thanks Mark.
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That's what I like to see - someone applying some common sense! ;-)
Thanks Mark.
It's slowly been dying away but I think I have some left :)
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There was actually an obituary on the BBC a while ago, in memoriam of the Common Sense, here (http://www.bbc.co.uk/stoke/content/articles/2009/02/03/obituary_common_sense_feature.shtml).
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There was actually an obituary on the BBC a while ago, in memoriam of the Common Sense, here (http://www.bbc.co.uk/stoke/content/articles/2009/02/03/obituary_common_sense_feature.shtml).
Certainly don't want to take the thread off track so will keep it short. Totally agree, having read some of the woes on how hard it is to fill out a form your comments appear to have foundation. There is such a thing as paper and pen and if the two meet it can be quite amazing what can be achieved. Thankfully breathing is not a conscious act.
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Since it seems to matter to some people I am a woodturner and for what it is worth, a committee member of a woodturning club. I am not an AWGB member although I once was but let my membership lapse as I felt that it offered me little. I would re-join if I felt that I would derive any benefit. I am not anti-AWGB and would like to see the organisation improve and move forward into the 21st century by appealing to a broader demographic.
I lurk here, usually without logging in but am rarely inspired to post however I feel that an important elephant in the room is being ignored.
It is interesting to note that UKIWS has been mentioned only once in this thread and in terms of it being a threat. I believe that if the AWGB treats UKIWS as a threat rather than an opportunity and fails to engage with it that will be mistake and one that they will come to regret. I have no connection with UKIWS other than as a person who has bought a ticket to their seminar.
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Without wanting to take sides..... Has the AWGB booked a stand at the UKIWS event ?
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karyudo said "I am not anti-AWGB and would like to see the organisation improve and move forward into the 21st century by appealing to a broader demographic. "
the question is how this should be achieved, we all know we need to appeal to a younger more vibrant audience but how we achieve it is the elusive part.
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Not my place to advise, but rather than adopting the at best patronising and at worst mocking attitude demonstrated by some in another thread towards the organisers of UKIWS for their lack of experience it might pay to acknowledge that they are engaging through social media with an audience with which the AWGB has consistently failed to connect and support them in their endeavours.
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I've just come back to this thread and discovered the existence of UKIWS
This prompts me to ask - possibly naively - why the woodturning community needs two symposia.
I apologise if previous subscribers have already asked this question
MCB
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Well, I guess it's a free world, so in theory (and in practice) just about everybody can go and organise their own symposium. The proof of the pudding will be in the eating.
As to why, I think it'd be best to ask them directly. Not sure you will get a reply. I tried to contact them, and did not get one. Whether that is because they are too busy, or because they are not keen on talking to AWGB members, I do not know. Since John (BHT) is one of their demonstrators, maybe he can shine a better light onto that.
From what I have seen so far, I don't think that the two events are really comparable. UKIWS is selling a maximum of 30 tickets for their pro demos, and there is only one venue for these. This is a much smaller event, and maybe that's just as well.
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I have just filled out the questionnaire and have read this thread from the beginning. I have no intentions of getting involved in the arguments but will only say this if you want to change something you have to do it from the inside it is no good sniping from the outside.
I went to the Seminar a couple of years ago and enjoyed everything about it .The organisation in my opinion was first rate and the mix of Demonstrators a good balance.
The only reason I did not go this year was the distance as most of my life has been driving great distances and I am fed up with it.
There are obviously things about the AWGB that could be improved as with any institution but basically I think it is sound and a lot of work is put in by people for no reward.
Our woodturning club at Burnham on sea is a fully paid up member of the AWGB and in my opinion the benefits are great for example our insurance costs are covered by the AWGB,we get an annual grant towards a demonstrator and our members can go on free courses if the want to. Having access to an area Rep and lots of free advice available to members.
I could go on but there is little point.
Regards George
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In reply to MCB I think the country could do with many more than 2 symposia but the UKIWS will be a totally different animal than the AWGB one. It is being organised on different lines to an Association event and also by people with possibly different ideas than our Executive. Each event will have the effect of raising the profile of woodturning in this country and that can't be a bad thing in my opinion. It may be more affordable to those that have always moaned about the AWGB one being too expensive, so I will expect to see those turners in June. But like all events regardless of who or what group are organising it you have to use it or risk losing it. I fully support the AWGB and have done so since the day I joined and now I am also fully supporting UKIWS.
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Well said John.