Seminar questionnaire

[Dave Atkinson]

I don't agree. The questions are designed to have simple Y/N answers in the main to questions we'd like to hear about.  There is a comments space if you want to say anything else.

The name and address field are optional.

The questionnaire is actually designed to be filled in by individuals on paper as we know many of our members don't use the internet.  What we have done is to put the whole questionnaire online and I have had a number of replies already, so there may be the odd redundant question.  But I don't see that as a big issue.  I don't want to have to consolidate a number of different questionnaires.

Over 2 or 3 days.  Important to us.  we don't have the resources to organise a longer one and it's not hard 2 days or 3 days.  We had daily options this year (and I know we've had that discussion on the other thread) and many people did just attend for a day.

Can't see what's difficult in suggesting which month you prefer.  We won't please everyone that's for sure.  

The figure is important.  We know that it costs around this much to put an event of this size on.  For example I have had some replies to my request for quotation from venues and the demonstration space costs over £3k for the weekend.  Expenses for demonstrators from the states start at over £1000 for air fare.  Many people have said they only want to pay less which is an option.

We can roll this around for ever before we please everyone.  I have no intention of changing it.  Those that have answered it so far (many at clubs already on paper)  and many online seem to have found it easy enough.

Cheers Dave

[PaulH]

I don't agree..... I have no intention of changing it.

No great surprise there.

Can't see what's difficult in suggesting which month you prefer.

 It's not about the difficulty in answering. My point was that it won't get you the information that would be useful.

The whole thing is a great example of confirmation bias, as you only want the answers you think you know already.

[Paul Hannaby]

Paul,
I disagree with all your points, with the exception of the question about internet use but Dave has already explained why that was there. When I created the web form, I did consider leaving that question out but I decided to leave it in for completeness.

For someone who has never been a member and has never supported anything we have done, you seem to have a lot to say! :-)

[John D Smith]

 Here we go again all PaulH seems to do is CRITICISE every thing that anyone does or says on behalf of the AWGB as I have asked before why

 don't  you join the AWGB ? I again invite you to Join 

 I find as I have said on a previous thread your remarks are not very helpful I would like to say more out of my frustration but I would probably be 
 
banned from the Forum
                                                  John

[PaulH]

Here we go again all PaulH seems to do is CRITICISE every thing that anyone does or says on behalf of the AWGB

Do you understand the concept of constructive criticism ? It's about pointing out failings and suggesting how they might be improved. Many businesses and other charities pay huge amounts for that service from consultants.

Did you read the OP about the seminar ?

.....If you have any suggestions about how we could improve the Seminar experience......

I did that. Some people didn't want to read of any failings, but if they don't want to make a 'significant loss' again for their members it's important that they address any issues brought to their attention.

Go back and re-read what I've actually posted, not what your prejudice thinks it might mean.

[malcy]

I have just completed the questionnaire, and have found it straightforward and askinkg for opinions about the organisation of the event with an open suggestions box foe ANY comments. No problem and well done for putting it together. Malcolm.

[Graham]

I have to agree with much of what Paul says, some of the questions do seem pointless or difficult to answer ( there is no way of saying I don't care which month of the year it is ) equally, some of the other questions would carry provisos in the answer. I don't really mind whether accommodation is onsite or offsite but since I don't drive it couldn't be to far away.

The main problem encountered with Loughborough was the distance from the accommodation to the lecture hall ( yes, we are mostly old farts ) I would have happily contributed to several morning and evening ( timed or announced ) runs from the minibus which would have solved that problem.

[Dave Atkinson]

I don't agree..... I have no intention of changing it.

No great surprise there.

Can't see what's difficult in suggesting which month you prefer.

 It's not about the difficulty in answering. My point was that it won't get you the information that would be useful.

The whole thing is a great example of confirmation bias, as you only want the answers you think you know already.

The reason I am not changing the questionnaire is that it is now ready for publishing in Revolutions and is already in use and many people have responded so we're not changing horses midstream.  Secondly, although you insist your  comments are constructive you haven't actually suggested any questions that we should ask. 

In the other thread I wrote "But we have a number of ideas - we shall seek sponsorship; we have approached nine different venue providers for information and a quotation and I expect these back by the end of November; we shall consider a new look and feel; we shall try to provide a varied programme to try to meet all tastes and interests."  We continue to receive all suggestions, whether they've been tried before or not.  We'll review them all during the first quarter 2016 when we know about venue charges.  So please don't suggest we don't listen. 

And your suggestion that we make it easier for people to find out what attendance options are available have been taken on board.  I must also point out that had you been a member, an individual one like me, you would have had a copy of Revs where the seminar was advertised in all its glory many times, including all the attendance options.  We actually know what the problem is we have 4000 members and less than 5% want to come, or are not prepared to come.   The questionnaire is designed to find out why.  As I don't know what the correct answer is to any of the questions I hardly see it as an exercise in confirmation bias.  I'm also interested in your comment that we won't get the information that would be useful.  With respect, how do you know what information we will find useful?

Graham if you aren't bothered which month then the answer to the question is "any".

Dave

[bodrighywood]

OK. My Pennyworth. The AWGB is run and maintained basically by a very few volounteers who put their all into it and deserve a lot more gratitude and thanks than they probably get. When you look at the number of members and the number of people actively involved it is frankly ridiculous. To have non members criticising, whether positive or otherwise and yet not prepared to actually offer help is, in my opinion, just going too far. Put up or shut up is something my grandmother taught me and if anyone (me included) wants to pick holes in what the few are doing then offer not just advice but help as well. I want woodturning to be recognised as a craft and art form in this country as it is in the States, Australia and one or two other places and am happy to do whatever I can to promote it but I cannot stand by whilst others pick holes and criticise from the sidelines those who try. Criticism, if given with an aim to improve is always valid but maybe the way it is put, and the attitude behind it should be.thought through as well. Thank you to all of you who actually do the work of th AWGB,  whether I agree with everything you do or the way that you do is irrelevant, thank you!!!!!!!

Pete, AWGB, RPT, totally disorganised but always willing to help

[PaulH]

The reason I am not changing the questionnaire is that it is now ready for publishing in Revolutions

I didn't seriously expect anything else.
A shame as one of the key advantages of the internet is the ability to change things like this immediately. It might just be correcting a typing mistake, or eliminating a silly idea that reflects badly on the site, or just reacting to feedback to refine the page and improve the usefullness of the data returned.
A prime example is "do you use the internet ?" It looks silly on a web page and the answer for that respondent is already defined anyway. It's in the same class as a survey by phone call asking if you have a telephone.

although you insist your  comments are constructive you haven't actually suggested any questions that we should ask.

 The problem here is not that you haven't asked enough questions, but that in some cases you've limited the range of answers possible or allowed too wide a range of answers to make data analysis straight forward.

I must also point out that had you been a member, an individual one like me, you would have had a copy of Revs where the seminar was advertised in all its glory many times, including all the attendance options. 

But I'm not a member, although you'd like non-members to attend and, hopefully, become part of the AWGB, correct ?

We actually know what the problem is we have 4000 members and less than 5% want to come, or are not prepared to come. 

or weren't able to attend.
Is members failing to be interested enough to attend 'The problem' ? or is it just insufficient numbers of people attending 'The problem' ? there's a significant difference there.
Or did you just misjudge how much you should charge ? which is a different problem again.

You may have decided that members failing to attend is the main cause of the loss, but you can't be sure of that. Just getting 40 non-members to attend would have allowed you to break even, one more would have seen you in profit.

The questionnaire is designed to find out why.

I don't have an easy answer to that, but I hope you've surveyed those that did attend their views and whether they would have been prepared to pay enough to have broken even.
If the questionnaire is specifically aimed at the 95% of AWGB members that didn't attend, you shouldn't make it public.

As I don't know what the correct answer is to any of the questions I hardly see it as an exercise in confirmation bias.

The problem with confirmation bias, is that the creators of the survey aren't aware of the bias. Sometimes it's easier for an outsider to see that a survey is going to give erroneous information, than the authors.

I'm also interested in your comment that we won't get the information that would be useful.  With respect, how do you know what information we will find useful?

As I've said, sometimes it's easier for an outsider with any preconceived ideas or prejudices to see what information would be useful than for people tied up with precedent.

Graham if you aren't bothered which month then the answer to the question is "any".

Except that isn't a possible answer.
Start to see my point now ?

[PaulH]

To have non members criticising, whether positive or otherwise and yet not prepared to actually offer help is, in my opinion, just going too far.

So constructive criticism from non-members isn't welcome then ?
What sort of 'help' do you expect ?

[bodrighywood]

If you think there are areas that you know more about than the ones doing all the work and can help, PM David, Andy or Paul and offer your expertise. Whilst I may agree with some of your observations the way that they are put are not helpful I am afraid. As someone who has a lot of experience in working in areas that need diplomacy and tact I am afraid that I ahve to say your way of putting things, however well meaning they may be, are not always helpful. Saying what is wrong is not enough, what could be done to improve and promote the AWGB are all valid observations but having a little insight into the workload of those doing it at the moment I would think that it would be a little more sensitive to offer your criticisms via a PM than voice them as you do publicly in a way that, though you may not see it, come across as simply criticism. Perhaps it is just the medium, things said vocally can be heard as they are meant, put into writing or online they can seem cold and hard.

pete

[Graham]

Not very helpful in this situation I know, but I can see both sides of this 'discussion' If you really want to know 'Why people didn't attend the seminar' It might be useful to send out a question asking 'Why didn't you come to the seminar ?'

I am not trying to be flippant but I have a feeling the answers ( If you actually get any ) may surprise you. They may have nothing to do with the work that you did for the seminar.

'I am getting to old for that, I don't even turn any more'

'I'm on a small pension/minimum wage, I cannot afford it'

'I have been before, I cannot walk up those hills again'

'I have been out of work, other things come first'

'The wife would kill me'

'I am not good enough yet to come to that'

etc etc.

[bodrighywood]

Not very helpful in this situation I know, but I can see both sides of this 'discussion' If you really want to know 'Why people didn't attend the seminar' It might be useful to send out a question asking 'Why didn't you come to the seminar ?'

I am not trying to be flippant but I have a feeling the answers ( If you actually get any ) may surprise you. They may have nothing to do with the work that you did for the seminar.

'I am getting to old for that, I don't even turn any more'

'I'm on a small pension/minimum wage, I cannot afford it'

'I have been before, I cannot walk up those hills again'

'I have been out of work, other things come first'

'The wife would kill me'

'I am not good enough yet to come to that'

etc etc.

Actually all valid points. I remember your concerns about attending Graham which were valid and when asked about were answered.

Pete

[PaulH]

PM David, Andy or Paul and offer your expertise.

That's email, not a forum.
I post my contributions openly so that others might agree or disagree and that the discussion might develop.

Perhaps it is just the medium, things said vocally can be heard as they are meant, put into writing or online they can seem cold and hard.

Just read things as written, there's no hidden agenda here.
The worst attitude online is 'if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything' no one learns from that.